| What has been your role in the new business efforts of the agency? | |
|---|---|
| Nickie Smith - Executive Assistant | Scheduling calls and follow up calls |
| Cindy Bower Production Manager | I handle all the production for the direct mail pieces and any accompanying pieces. I also handle the production of the demo reels and have done some editing for a presentation of man on the street interviews. I also handle some of the trafficking of the projects throughout the agency. |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | Behind the scenes support. Providing need TV-related research, media planning, and proposals as requested. During on in-person, in-office pitch, I did present the TV options to the prospect along with 4 other TMC staff. Rarely called in for prospect calls. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | Primary responsibility (except for brief period when had a (bad) new biz director) |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | Creative concepting for sales efforts. New business initiative ideas and sales pieces. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | I have basically been Nathan's #1 new business go-to recently, though I am currently the only accounts person handling 70 accounts so I do not have time to oversee the new business efforts to the extent it needs to be done, especially in the disorganized last minute fashion we have been doing it in. |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | I used to be involved in prospect coordinating and preparing proposals/pitches - back when I was the only AE at TMC. Now as a PM, I consult w/ NEC on the sales strategy and pricing strategy as it relates to New Biz. And I of course project manage all business development projects, such as the TMC website, sales materials, etc. |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | pushing the need for new business effort when it was shockingly being ignored. Also support, advice, raising the bar. |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | Typical support function. |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | Developing quotes, research for pitches, developing new products |
| What is your background, in terms of agencies, accounts, and client-side experience? | |
| Nickie Smith - Executive Assistant | No agency experience prior to working here but I did run a family furniture business for several years. I know it's a different animal but it was still "sales". |
| Cindy Bower Production Manager | I have over 36 years in the agency business and have work in various capacities but mostly as Executive Broadcast Producer/Account Supervisor. I freelanced for 14 years within that time period as a project manager, producer, location scout, account manager, broadcast producer, print production manager and traffic manager. I have worked on a variety of local and regional accounts including Cox Communications, a variety of banks, grocery store chains, department stores, Wm. B. Reilly Foods (coffees, mayonnaise, jams), Crystal Hot sauce, N.O. Jazz & Heritage Festival, Telecommunications companies, Gas Company, Entergy Solutions, Regional McDonald's Campaign, Touro Hospital, Tulane Hospital, Lakeview Hospital, Lakeside Woman's Hospital, People's Health, just to name a few. |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | The Marketing Center Background - I've been in the TMC Media Dept for 9 yrs (this June). Started as a Media Asst, then promoted to Media Buyer, then promoted to Media Manager. Currently, I manage Ashley (Media Buyer), Julie (Media Asst), & Adham (Phone Data Analyst). Chris Jewell & Travis Hose (managed by Kathy in Finance) is works on Media-Related projects such as station invoice auditing & traffic management. Current Client-Side Experience: Although having limited client-facing interaction, I am familiar our clients TV campaigns within the agency. Ashley & I are the only 2 buyers and keep each other in the loop regarding client issues. In addition to my media responsibilities, Ashley & I also help steward our clients' Google Adwords Paid Search Campaigns along with Digital Dept.Throughout the years, I have talked to clients via phone, email, or in person as needed. I have also attended one NOSSCR conf (May 2014) to represent TMC when another AE was unable to attend. McCann-Erickson/LCI - Prior to joining TMC in 2006, I worked as a Media Buyer Asst, then Jr. Buyer at their New Orleans office. No client-facing interaction. Client direction & media planning came from LCI Corp office to us. Clients included: GM, Kohl's, Lowe's, Johnson & Johnson, Jack Daniels, Subaru, Popeye's, etc. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | Worked at general ad agency for 2 years in 1980s (laid off). In house agency for big dept store chain for another 2 years. Free lance a few years before starting this agency in 1991. So my lack of agency experience has come back to haunt me. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | 1 year in media buying 1 years in advertising sales 4 years as a copywriter 1 years as an AE 3 years as a digital strategist These aren't in order just overall experience. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | 2 years at The Marketing Center. I was hired as a Jr. AE, was promoted after 3 months to AE, and promoted to Account Manager after 1 year which was partly circumstantial because we had an employee leave and no one knew the accounts better than me at that time. Before that, I was always in sales (not in an agency) living in New York City (InStyle magazine, the Village Voice). This has been my first agency job. |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | I started my career as the New Business Coordinator at a local full service agency. Was there for 5 years learning everything I could about the pitch process, prospecting, building a database, gathering the pitch team, coordinating the details of the pitch, and eventually worked my way up to the pitch team itself. I spent most of my time then working directly with the CEO & VP. Basically I was like the conductor of the orchestra making sure all the pieces and parts came together. I was fortunate enough to even tour some bigger regional agencies and learn under their new business people of how a real pitch should operate. When I left that firm, I joined the Marketing Center as the first Account Executive. I wanted to be more hands on with clients...so built that department to a team of 3 and then moved into Project Management. The lawyer-clientele burned me out a bit. I wasn't used to working with such an unsophisticated marketing group - and lawyers are VERY demanding. I also learned over time that my true passion was in the project management piece and moving things forward, finding efficiencies, and studying profitability. So TMC was great in supporting my desire to create a Project Management role at the agency. And the timing was perfect because we were taking on greater digital work, had a bigger team, etc. and it just felt right to have a Project Manager in place to help oversee the profitability of the work and manage the workflow with the team. I like to describe myself as a Traffic Manager on steroids :) |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | 1 year in 1978 as an agency media buyer trainee (not something I requested; a job I was given by an agency owner when I applied for a copywriter position.) |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | I have been a member of the TMC team for 12 years. This is my first position with an agency. |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | 3.5 years in previous position, moving from production to hybrid production-accounts role. Handled client-side communications as a specialist. Liason between accounts & development Constantly wrote inbound-marketing materials & distributed on social networks |
| As if you were writing to a prospective client, describe the agency in no more than 3 sentences: | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | Our agency is eager to help you increase leads, evaluate ROI, and grow your practice. We have an experienced team in place to help evaluate your current advertising, as well as, suggest ways to stay competitive within your market. With over 20 years experience, we are committed to latest legal marketing in an efficient & cost effective way. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | (It'd differ if an SSD firm or other legal) Nobody on the planet has more experience in helping disability law firms grow their firms than our unique niche advertising and marketing agency. With 70 firms as clients from Maine to Hawaii, we have developed our own "best practices" and proprietary data on how to reach disability claimants. In many ways, we believe we know your clients better than you do. Ask us how. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | No other agency knows legal marketing better. We know your claimaints, we know your attorneys and we know how to market your firm successfully. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | We are a full service marketing and advertising agency specializing in legal marketing. We plan and execute 360 degree marketing approaches consisting of a combination of branding, TV commercial production, media buying, website design and monthly management, and SEM depending on the objectives and budget of prospects. |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | The Marketing Center is a full-service, New Orleans advertising agency that specializes in legal marketing for clients all over the U.S. |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | We're an analytical marketing firm focusing on effective multi-channel lead-generation for lawyers who help people who have injuries or disabilities that affect their lives. Through quality advertising and content, we measurably increase leads through managed media buys, paid online advertising, and conversion-focused websites. |
| The New York Times decides they are going to write an article about your agency. After spending a day at your offices, and then going back to write the piece.... what would the headline be? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | Small New Orleans Agency hold its own in Legal Marketing Space |
| Nathan Chapman, President | Pioneering disability legal ad agency wants to prove they're not just for Social Security anymore. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | New Orleans Ad Agency is Ready to Spread Legal Marketing |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | New Orleans Legal Marketing Agency has good ideas and talented team members but lacks resources to deliver on promises - understaffed and overworked company doesn't practice what it preaches |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | My dream would be something positive like "Small Firm Making a Big Impact in Legal Marketing" or "Bringing Class to Lawyer Advertising". However, the reality is probably something more like "Marketing Center of the Universe...Collapsing into a Black Hole...." |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | TV Ad Agency struggles to reinvent itself. |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | Marketing Agency Uses Decades of Experience to Bring Attorneys into 21st Century |
| Now bring the agency to life. You have certainly been through this exercise, however applying it to your agency agency can be quite revealing in understanding more about your "DNA". If the agency were a car, what kind would it be? What color? Why? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | (I have not been through this exercise - did I miss something?) A silver mid-size Lexus SUV. Our agencies offerings are similar to other agencies/cars out there, although our work is higher quality than other agencies/cars out there. Our pricing isn't always the cheapest, but there's a premium for more attention, more options, or more account maintenance. We are silver because we currently just blending in, not doing much to stand out. Not the fastest car on the road we are always trying to catch up. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | Volvo - not sexy but well built, smart, selected for functionality. Black - Quality minded. Wants to stand out. But not in a flashy way. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | A late 2000 model Mercedes-Benz. Color would be silver (I don't know why that's just the color that comes to mind.) I picked this because we aren't quite up-to-date on best agency practices, but our agency is a specialized agency that really is a luxury car in terms of the industry we're in. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | Brown Oldsmobile - it runs satisfactorily which is why the owner hasn't thrown in the towel and sold it, but there is nothing progressive about it. Not sexy or interesting or makes anyone who rides in it feel special. When you try to roll the windows down and floor the accelerator and build up some speed, the car stalls. |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | FULL DISCLOSURE - I am truly terrible when it comes to cars. So I enlisted my husband's help to find me the exact thing I was describing...I think we hit the jackpot :) We would be a Red Pontiac Fiero - they are no longer in service actually. It was a fancy little sports car that was progressive for its time. But it had a serious design flaw that caused the fuel line to pop off every time you would accelerate, dousing fuel all over the hot engine, causing it to catch on fire. It had good intentions. It wanted to be great. But they let their ego overshadow reality, and went down in flames. |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | a 1953 Studebaker in 1953. Blue. Because, as I understand it, Studebaker had a great foundation, great steady, solid rise, but was overcome by forces with which it did not address and they did not address the foundation in the shaky days. It was never truly a carriage trade product but very popular for a long time. By 1955 it was losing money and even a merger could not save it. |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | Blue Buick. Dependable, sort of old fashioned. |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | I want to say something like the reissued Thunderbird. Some of the best qualities of retro roots, but maybe focused on the wrong things and the wrong market. |
| What agencies do you most admire? Why? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | Peter Mayer - local agency that seems to attract the talent the city has to offer because of their local reputation & client history. Great creative. Various National, multi-niche agencies - efficient, access to resources. Client interaction separate from planning, separate from execution Media & Digital. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | Zenhder in New Orleans - nice tourism niche (with clients with deeper pockets than ours) that allows them to do creative, award winning work, and they are down to earth personalities. Others I might list are observed much more from a distance - was impressed by some of the niche examples that Tim Williams gave us - like the agency that focuses in rural..or in building materials. Had really nice websites, but that's as deep as I got on getting to know them. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | Razorfish -- I've always had a high regard for them when it comes to creative. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | I admire agencies that have the creative freedom to execute their good ideas. I admire agencies that have a clear positioning statement and clear services/products offered with concrete pricing. I admire agencies that deliver on their promises. One example of this is we had a prospect call recently where we critiqued their site and told them what they should be doing better and where they could improve... the prospect asked to see an example of one of our sites that illustrates all of these best practices that we were touting. We couldn't because we don't have one. |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | I most admire the little guys that land a big opportunity and nail it. I'm probably going to struggle to say a specific one but once in a while, you come across a really boutique creative or digital firm you've never heard of but their creative or execution of it is just perfect. Because to me, they are the ones REALLY working for it. I imagine the big guys - the Chiat Days or EuroRSGs - just have all these resources and people and really, they should easily nail it every time right? I like the underdog. On a personal note, I've always admired and followed McKinney in North Carolina. I worked with someone from there many years ago, and had the opportunity to visit their facility and meet the people and loved everything about it. The culture, the office, their new business process...it was one of those places where you could see yourself working there till 10p every nite but being okay with it because the end result of all the blood, sweat and tears would be worth it, ya know? |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | Carriage trade agencies which produce beautiful, sophisticated, elegant advertising. |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | n/a |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | The ones that I most admire are the ones who you never hear about, but are never hurting for business. SEER Interactive in Philadelphia is one name that I always point to, mainly because of their displayed marquee work and visibility of culture through their CEO. Though, reading their negative Glassdoor reviews, it sounds a lot like the environment that I happily avoided - high turnover, high stress. |
| List the top few agencies that you do/will compete against most often. | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | No clue on local competitors due to our exclusivity rules. Locally several agencies have big law firm clients: for interest, the largest Morris Bart is with Morgan & Co. In the SSD Marketing World, the competition is growing: Ed Malley, PMP Marketing, & PR Legal Marketing. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | The biggest competition in legal entities are the entities that sell leads. Perceived as very cost efficient. Some firms (esp ones willing to travel beyond a local city) are thriving on them. But there is an icky underbelly that many attorneys don't like, like questionable methods done anonymously (and other downsides). Reminder we don't really want the heavy-hammer big PI firms, for whom there are several good agencies. We don't have a peer in terms of non-PI TV, other than local production companies. For online, we compete mostly against FindLaw. But for the WHOLE marketing perspective, if not PI, we don't have competition that I worry about. But we are getting lost in the noise. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | FindLaw Hibu (for digital only) Local ad agencies that we may or may not be aware of. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | FindLaw James Publishing Hibu (not so much agencies but vendors. Prospects don't see value of hiring an agency instead of a bunch of vendors. They think since we do a bunch of different things, we can't do them all well and they are right. Also, our prices aren't the cheapest). |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | FindLaw, Scorpion, SunTel |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | None seriously yet because of niche. |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | not sure |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | In digital, it's a few competitors. http://www.scorpiondesign.com/ often for site builds and PPC http://prlegalmarketing.com/ works with a number of our clients currently for content creation http://www.lawyermarketing.com/ (FindLaw) is probably our largest competitor, since their gig seems to be high-volume sales of templated sites and low-quality but overall effective ongoing SEO. |
| In the eyes of clients, what do you provide of value, that none of your competitors do? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | Cost efficiency in TV buying. High-quality commercials, not cheesy. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | I wrote this on this survey's page 4 but want to bring it up earlier in the survey: For most of our clients, there is a very high loyalty rate (I think we had over 40 firms with us over 10 years) and even a Starbucks-level of brand passion, tho (immodestly - don't show this on a slide to the team!!) a lot of that is about my personal brand with them (which we don't really market because the team wants to be seen more as a team than extensions of me.) When hired, I am told 100% (not 99%) of the time, "We hired you because you're (I am unclear how much this means me personally vs the agency - probably a mix) the expert." That stays true. Also, I'm told I'm a perfectionist, which is meant as a compliment. They feel like I'm very honest and watching out for their interests. With a big company like FindLaw or Hibu (a division of Yellow Pages) or LexusNexus, you never talk to the principal like you can with me. We are less mass-market than them. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | A vast knowledge and wealth of insights into legal marketing that no other agency can offer. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | Media buying analytics. Phone data analysis, cost per call data. Our expertise and where we provide value is in TV and media buying which is becoming obsolete. |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | Nathan. Many of them see him as a leader in the marketplace and the inventor of the field. This is more true in the disability world than other legal areas. While they probably dont realize it fully, our greatest value should be something in the realm of the fact that we can bring a 360 degree view to their marketing strategy. Our competitors are all specialists by medium, but we are specialists in the category. And can share insights across platforms, study trends of what works here vs here and shift dollars between the two. We dont fully do that but we could/should and I believe that could be our greatest value. |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | experience. low prices. analytics |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | Years of ecxperience |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | I feel the two biggest points would be effectiveness of creating leads and the hands-on personal support. I think among our clients, they in general feel like we know disability law. I feel that we have the opportunity to de-silo their marketing as well - not sure how effective we are at that. I feel that clients don't know this, but I do believe that we are very transparent and goal-focused in our marketing compared to other firms -- one that I recently remember has a beautiful reporting dashboard, but wasn't reporting the massive paid search underspend (or mismangement) that was leading to literally hundreds less clicks per day. |
| In the eyes of clients, what do your competitors provide of value, that you do not? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | Guaranteed number of leads. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | For most of our clients, TV is still their #1 source of leads, but at a significantly higher cost per lead. We have worked like hell to be seen as NOT just TV but also online. (Actually, what I say regularly is that Marketing is in our name, not TV or even advertising. We help wherever it helps them most.) I think we have succeeded in perception of digital expertise tho not necessarily sign ups. Currently, (only) 50% of our clients use our digital services. Our biggest challenge is that we are perceived as more expensive. (In many cases that's true, esp compared to local options. With FindLaw it's not necessarily true - just structured pricing differently.) |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | They do everything cheaper, but not as well. So it's about price over quality. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | Digital. Our team is too small. It's not that they couldn't compete if they had help, but we are competing against business that only do digital and have hundreds of people. We have two guys handling 34 websites and they can't focus on big picture strategy because they are just struggling to keep their heads above water. Backlog can't seem to stay down. They make sloppy, careless errors because they have too much on their plates. Building backlinks is a specific example. We don't have the man power. |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | A lower cost option usually. Not necessarily better quality, but almost always cheaper and a little clearer picture of what you get for the money. |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | cheaper prices, cheaper product. |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | Not sure |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | Price point, for sure. I think some of our competitors create more "wow-factor" sites, but I feel that clients don't understand that those sites are often less effective. |
| Are there any negative perceptions that prospects might have about the agency that could hold you back in new business? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | That we are a TV-only agency & TV is expensive. That we cannot do on the online or "internet" things other companies offer. Although the agency started with TV & has a strong group of TV advertising, it has taken years to convince some current clients that they needed a basic, functioning website, much less new clients. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | Breaking into 2 categories: Non SSD, they have never heard of us, and our name says Disability Law (which can work in some categories like Special Ed or even Workers Comp, but not most like Immigration or Employment Law). For SSD, we are seen as expensive, committed to expensive TV and old school, but mostly we are lost in the noise. BTW, we had a deep pitch with a very big PI/SSD firm in Pittsburgh - big enough that we flew there for our final presentation (which blew them away.) One principal said, "Ive seen you for 20 years and had no idea you had this level of expertise. I thought you just made and placed TV ads." We have another call coming up in about a week. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | A lack of awareness of our company. We may also seem like we aren't very well organized at times. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | We have heard rumors that current clients have bad mouthed our digital services to other clients. Other negative perceptions: we are the TV guys... we are too expensive... we are old-school. |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | That we're expensive. Because they are not marketing savvy, they often don't see the difference in quality, and even if they do, they do not value it enough to warrant paying for the better quality product. Rather than pay more for "great", they would pay less for "fair" and be happy with it. |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | too pricey for their unsophisticated comprehension. |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | TV guys. Not innovators |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | Old fashioned. Slow to act. I feel our clients don't trust us on digital, so they often go other places for one-off tasks, like a few thousand dollar campaign, which then gets visibly mismanaged, which damages the advertising method for future pitches (display, paid search). |
| How would you divide up the legal category into segments (types) in terms of different target audiences for the agency? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | SSD: Adults 35-64. PI: Adults 18+. BK: Adults 25-54. Special Education: Women 25-49. WC: Adults 18+ (primarily male). |
| Nathan Chapman, President | 1. "A list" SSD - meaning more $ resources to spend on marketing. It's actually a modest sized list (about 20?) if we continue to be exclusive by market. 2. B-list SSD - we will take smaller ones if they pay our (likely too modest for us) minimums. 3. Special Education Law - a new category that has the potential of SSD, but the firms are even more mom and pop. We have one client to date, who is doing well now in 2 states. I think we should target these folks with webinar and/or conference. 4. "Tim Williams" list (he didn't give the list but came up with the idea) of non-SSD firms with 20+ attorneys and millions in legal fees; none seem to do TV, so we say internally we need to be the uber digital legal marketing agency so we have been working to expand that dept. Hoped to pitch starting in June (if ready - not finalized our pricing strategy yet, tho working on). 5. Non-SSD B-list. We fear Congress so we want to diversify now. So willing to take smaller non-SSD firms, like I am pitching a New Orleans Workers Comp firm right now. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | SSD -- 45-60, all walks of life, genders, etc. WC -- 35-60, working class, both genders, etc. PI -- 30-65, it really is all over the place, but typically, women are the decision makers in the decision funnel Spec. Ed. -- 35-50, parents, women are typically decision makers |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | Social Security Disability Worker's Comp Attys Special Ed Disability Personal Injury Attys (we don't have much experience with big PI firms) |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | Disability (Social Security & Long Term), Workers Compensation, Personal Injury - those are the 3 biggies for us now. I think our long term potential is in anything in litigation (could be Veterans, Immigration, Environmental, etc) - B2C firms. NOT transactional or corporate law. |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | Dividing it by type of client represented, then by average revenue per client. We've been down this road before. Our best target was attorneys who help injured individuals fight against larger organizations - Social Security, Personal Injury, Workers Comp, etc. |
| What do you believe to be the highest priority target segment for the agency to go after for new business? Why? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | SSD is what we know, but we seem to be tapped out on SSD attys that haven't heard of TMC and want TMC's services. PI attys or multi-atty firms are plentiful, and seem to have large advertising budgets per Kantar reports. With so many current small firm attys, TMC often struggles and takes a close look at revenue when clients cancel or resign. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | In our hall of fame of consultants, David Baker convinced me that the root of many of my problems is we have too many small clients, thus creating the treadmill of not enough $ so get more clients, too much work so hire more people, rinse, repeat. I do believe that. We are underpriced and understaffed (or more accurately, over-cliented). Right now, we cant afford to fire our smaller clients and with SSD having industry problems, it's hard raising our prices on current or prospective clients (tho we have a bit.) So group 4 above makes the most sense to me. So while we are working our way through the prep/infrastrcucture, it's just out of our comfort zone in many respects: Non-SSD so we are not quite recognized as the experts...reliance on digital a dept where we do solid work but not yet uber work...and requires a much higher level of pricing that we have not figured out nor have experience with. We also don't know anything about that target: How do they get their clients now? What do they think their needs are? While they may have more $, are we sure they will be any more willing to invest it in high quality marketing, or as non-businesses (law firms) will they also have a mom and pop mentality? No research done yet. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | Big law firms with the ability to spend money for a TV campaign and high-quality website. We really need to start focusing on larger firms since the smaller firms are starting to not be able to fully afford all of our services. We have to work on some things internally (stronger digital team, pricing models, bigger creative staff) to really make a push to get these kinds of agencies. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | Large firms with several practice areas - all of the above and more. Reason is that these bigger firms have more money to spend and also aren't going to be struggling as much from the current negative state of the SSD industry. |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | Probably something in the Personal Injury - maybe Product Liability? It's just such a HUGE market. And we're really good at connecting with consumers who feel wronged or owed something. I think the potential for digital marketing in the PI field is attractive. |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | large agencies with some sophistication and money to spend. |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | I really do not know. I do not think we have done the requisite research. |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | I would say the primary target would be to have a SSD client in every DMA. We have the experience in that niche to say "yes, we can do this." Many times, these types of attorneys have other practice areas as well, and that's were we work on things like workers' comp, personal injury, etc. I do think we should back off on the "general" attorneys who may focus slightly on SSD. |
| What do you believe to be the second priority target segment for the agency to go after? Why? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | Worker's Comp. We have experience producing WC commercials, TV, and paid search. We talked about adding Employment Law as an extension of our WC offerings. We need to stick with what we know legal, but expand into other types of firms that aren't dependent on govt funding & support. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | I am torn between category 1 and 3. 1 (A list SSD) is they safer choice: Presumed to have deeper pockets, but everyone in the industry is hurting, even the big players; its hard to tell how much hurting. Our pitch would be "now more than ever, you need to market smarter." But many big firms made $ on volume. With judges denying more cases, they have a business model problem bigger than marketing. Also, if the new Congress changes laws to make the situation worse (possible) this does not help with diversification. On the other hand, I assume we will keep working this category because it doesn't require all that much time/resources to do so. Category 3 is a non conventional choice because it's not pure advertising, which is what we know. But if we could have a conference (Mirren has been an inspiration for me) which made money and funneled us as clients, could be very interesting. We have credibility in this niche and there is ZERO competition. The lead-selling folks don't even know about this niche. I will warn that my team is skeptical about this niche, mostly due to lack of results for about 2 years. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | Mid-sized law firms with moderate budgets to spend on digital and TV. I would definitely consider these a B priority. I think our main focus needs to be on the larger agencies. Regardless of the size of the law firm, we do need to address the internal issues mentioned above. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | Low hanging fruit would be SSD firms. But not local ones (which are so small). Regional or even national ones. Reason is that this is what we have done for 20+ years. Can't go after regional/national SSD firms at this point though because of our exclusivity clause. |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | The PI category is very broad, but if stepping out of that bucket, environmental law may be an interesting pursuit. I recently engaged in a conversation with a friend involved in the BP oil settlement and again, going back to the whole "we can help connect w/ consumers/clients who feel like they are owed something" - this category may have some potential for us in terms of big revenue projects. |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | not sure |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | I really do not know. I do not think we have done the requisite research. |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | I would say larger PI firms, with the knowledge that the niche is much more expensive all around. |
| What are the top 3 road blocks that most hold you back with new business? (check only 3) | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | |
| Nathan Chapman, President | |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | |
| When pitching new business that doesn’t ultimately convert, what are typically the top 3 reasons? Consider both the client's expectations and how you compare to your competitive set. (check only 3) | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | |
| Nathan Chapman, President | |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | |
| When pitching new business that does convert, what do think are typically the top 3 reasons? (check only 3) | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | |
| Nathan Chapman, President | |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | |
| What has been most effective at bringing business in the door to date? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | presence at NOSSCR conference, primary convention for SSD attys nationwide |
| Nathan Chapman, President | 1. Exhibit booth (and related activities) at their professional conference. But note this is expensive in money and time, so we have not yet decide if we should go to conferences for other types of law like Workers Comp, Immigration, etc. In old days when we brought in a bunch of new SSD biz, it was great. Now, I get one or 2 per conference. Still, that's not zero. 2. Historically direct mail (but seemed to be losing effectiveness) followed up by a formerly awesome testimonial video (too out of date, so stopped using it; wanted to ask you about whether we should spend the $ to update it, Ill send you a copy. Our clients do have Starbucks-level passion for us. That is not to be taken lightly.). 3. We are just now finessing and rolling out our content marketing program. I did get pinged from a good prospect the other day and he said it was because he read our email/blog post and then checked out our site (which has NOT yet been reworked for the new legal niche - soon... but content is still pre-Tim Williams, from when we thought we wanted to be not-just-legal) |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | Our creative materials used in the first phase. Also, our expertise in this niche. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | Meeting people in person (at NOSSCR for example) |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | We're definitely better in person. If we can get a face to face, we always have at least a 2nd meeting or a proposal. It's something psychological in that we better prepare knowing we will have the facetime. But take the same exact meeting and put it over the phone and we are much less prepared, dont do our homework as diligently upfront, and panic. In person, we listen more. Via phone, we mostly talk AT them. Preparation is huge. If we focus and properly prepare ahead of time and do our due diligence, we are more successful. If we wait until the last minute, we panic and fluster a bit. We're also more successful when its something we know and are comfortable with. Again, this probably ties into the preparation part...we can do a pitch to a big SSD firm in our sleep with little to no preparation (the pitch itself may not be great still if its via phone...bc we will talk AT them). But if its something we are less comfortable in, like PI, we will panic a bit because we didn't spend the time studying their business and learning their target market. See, in SSD, we can pitch that in our sleep not so much because we know the firm, but because we know their audience - disability claimants. And our pitch centers around that fact. But we almost never do research on the target market for other legal categories (which I think the prospective client would find attractive). Instead, we pitch our services...sell them a product...we're just a commodity at that point. |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | Prospects with money looking for more business. |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | I'm not sure. We have had solid initial response to some ideas, but overall it seems like those leads peter out. |
| What percentage of sales calls completed by telephone/online typically convert into a new client? What do you find to be the pros and cons of telephone/online approach? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | No clue - probably 0%. I don't think we've ever signed a client that found out about via web, phone call, or direct mail. Most are aware of Nathan or the agency through NOSSCR, or from a current/former clients referral. Pros of telephone approach: quick, can have a script for sales pitch. Cons: Not tweaked for each client, not face-to-face, impersonal. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | First, let me note we have yet to try it via Skype, just cause it was outside of our comfort zone. Recently did a couple of client meetings via Skype and became fans.Think it would help...I think this question is about pitching by phone. I'd say I signed up half of our clients, maybe more, before we met them...? In some cases, like the pitch we recorded for you, we had met him briefly at our exhibit booth but then the pitch later was by phone. (We offered Skype). I sometimes pitch in their offices - I much prefer it, but not sure the track record is actually better statistically. Usually success is due to other factors like cost, complexity, etc. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | I'm not sure as I don't have any insight into this part of the process. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | 5%; harder to foster chemistry People do business with people they like. It is harder to get someone to like you over the phone. |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | 1% maybe? Telephone is fine for qualifying the lead. Seeing if they are in the ballpark of the type of client we want to have. I also think you learn a lot about a person by the types of questions they have and what they tell you about their firm etc (like if they call just to ask "well how much does it cost to build a website"..that tells me they aren't super marketing savvy...maybe they are, but it would be a red flag for me...). But converting them via phone is very hard, and getting harder. Especially as we go out of the SSD category. You dont build a relationship via phone. You don't excite them in the presentation. And we dont LISTEN to their marketing problems via phone. I believe that if we first qualify them and they are worth a real pitch, we should get on a plane and do it in person so we can engage in a meaningful conversation and position ourselves as a solution to their marketing challenge. |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | I don't know. |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | I would say very very low percentage. We also aren't going out there and putting our name in the hat, so I'm not sure if it's an effectiveness question or a volume question. |
| What are the biggest changes you’ve seen in marketing the agency to law firms over the past 24 - 26 months? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | Started blogging in late 2014. Email marketing blasts still going out. Still doing direct mail as we have for years. Still attending NOSSCR. Not much new. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | Lost some high level leadership, so team is younger/greener. We lost - and are trying to replace but have been looking since like August! - a high level digital dept head who not only helped run the dept, but was great at presentations, because full of both confidence and knowledge. In 2014, we hired a new biz person, who was the wrong person but it did allow us to ramp up the new biz program (good). Starting Nov/Dec, we started our content marketing program (still not fully fleshed out). Think it's a good effort. Still need to beef up list (but in non-spammy way). |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | It has rapidly switched more to digital. Unfortunately, our agency hasn't been as quick to pick up on this shift. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | We've been trying to focus more on offering one-off services (like paid search campaign only) rather than handling every aspect of campaign but we haven't closed any yet. We've been focusing less on TV and more on digital but our media department is still the largest and only department that is fully staffed. |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | We have more competition for sure, particularly in the digital space. The clients are more marketing savvy and educating themselves more. They don't trust us quite as much as they used to. And probably the biggest thing is we have to be MUCH more proactive in pursuing leads - in past, we would have maybe two times/year where we would get a stream of leads calling...maybe because we did more ongoing marketing efforts then...maybe because there was less competition and we were more top of mind? Either way, we rarely get those stream of calls now. We have to work harder to get those leads on the phone. |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | gradual decline in converting since the SSD industry is extremely stressed and in turmoil and under attack politically |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | I think a lot less firms are looking at TV. I feel that more firms are getting digital, but there's so much misinformation that they end up focusing on odd things that aren't effective or are even hurtful. |
| Where does the agency most need to improve to accommodate for this shift in new business? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | We need to streamline our process; every time we reinvent the wheel as to what, how, & who will pitch to. We need to ask the client THEIR needs, instead of promoting the our work and trying to make them into our ideal client. We need to look at each new business piece and evaluate the ROI - is direct mail working? Is NOSSCR working? Would meeting with prospects in a video conference be better? |
| Nathan Chapman, President | Need to hire high level digital person to help with new biz pitches (and strategy), need to finish figuring out higher pricing strategy, need to systematize new biz efforts. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | We need a much stronger digital team. A two-person team is just not going to cut it. I realize we're hiring for two more of the positions, but this is a critical need for the agency at the moment. To stay on top of our game and legal marketing in general, we have got to creative a top-tier digital team. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | Hire the right people (or just hire people period... anyone is better than no one at all). We've been looking for a digital strategist for MONTHS. Also, as an agency we need to stop talking about new business and what we will do and just DO IT. Probably 6 months ago, I completed a very similar survey for a different new business consultant... I just want us to stop talking about it and just start doing it. I feel like every day at work is groundhog day. We have the same conversations, reach the same conclusions, and nothing changes. It's exhausting. Nathan suffers from paralysis by analysis. I often feel like we burn through all our time and energy treading water rather than moving in any direction at all. |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | 1) Planning/preparation - without a new business team, everything is chaotic and we miss opportunities because we are not well prepared. 2) Team - no new business team or leader to really drive initiatives and be proactive. No one sees it as a priority or is forward thinking in this regard. 3) Digital Strategy - we're struggling to deliver our basic digital products and do so in a quality way. We miss deadlines often, we don't have a digital strategist or anyone looking at the clients brand from a holistic perspective... the clients tell us what improvements to make to their site when often, there are things they find that WE should be foreseeing if we truly are their brand managers. |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | find and appeal to different law practices. |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | The biggest thing is to cement ourselves as industry experts to people who are not brand aware. We need to take this knowledge that we do have and put it out on niche, but public forums. I think we also need to take a look at what we do with TV to offer more "wow factor." |
| Overall, what do you think the agency most has to do to improve at new business? | |
| Mandy Lee, Media Manager | We need to do it more often and be confident in our pricing. Price to make money while being competitive; charge for being the experts. We need to accept that clients may only want digital, only want TV, or only want us for a website. |
| Nathan Chapman, President | We usually get to second base (they want a proposal) but then don't close after that. Need to figure out what's wrong there. |
| Clark Castle, Associate Creative Director | We need a dedicated new business person who has one sole focus: getting new business. Right now it's a piecemeal approach and it's not effective in terms of time or resources. |
| Carey Faust, Account Manager | Our digital department needs help. We need a big picture digital strategist and more support/low-level people so that we can build the kind of websites we say we can build. We need examples of our work we are proud of that illustrate best practices and demonstrate what we can do. We need to build up our portfolio. I think having a new business person to help Nathan could help as well but we've gone through 2 new business people in the past year. One got fired (didn't jive with Nathan and eventually got burnt out) and one quit after 2 months because Nathan would not relinquish any level of control. The new business is his baby and he insists on doing it his way (even when maybe his way is no longer the best way). I think we all understand this, but it just isn't the most efficient solution. We need a deck or marketing materials to market TMC. We need more of a process. We can't reinvent the wheel every time we have a pitch. I think we need not involve so many team members (who because of understaffing issues are already swamped) every time. There should be more filtering so that we aren't pulling out the big guns for every single prospect (even those that really aren't viable). |
| Katie Baxter, Project Manager | First and foremost, we need a plan with a clear focus of WHO we want to go after so we can be more selective in our pursuits, which will allow us more time to prepare for the RIGHT opportunities. We need a new business leader and/or team that keeps it as a priority and is proactive in moving new business forward. And finally, assuming we have found the ideal prospective client, we need to improve our presentation by learning their business, their audience, and deriving insights that are powerful and impressive that take our boring phone pitch to an impressive (in person) wam-bam presentation. |
| Dennis L. Alonzo, Co-owner, Secretary/Treasurer | Get a closer, more new business activity, more confidence, more direction and long term plan. |
| Kathy Perra. Controller | Develop a well thought out plan. We talk, we meet and we meet again. No focus or follow through. |
| Douglas Thomas Interactive Manager | The biggest two things would be to: 1) Get pricing down to a science so we don't have to waffle on what things cost and why. 2) Get our targets right -- let's go after firms that can afford us and want to hear what we have to offer. It's not just the cultural fit, but also the point in their firm's budget cycles, etc. |